gun control

[Creative Fab]

From: Ed Chenel, A police officer in Australia
>
> Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from
> Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia
> were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be
> destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers
> more than $500 million
> dollars.
>
> The first year results are now in: Australia-wide, homicides are up
> 3.2 percent, Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent;
> Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
> In the state of Victoria alone,
> homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. (Note that while the
> law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not! and criminals
> still possess their guns!)
>
> While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in
> armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in
> the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their
> prey is unarmed.
>
> There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of
> the elderly.
>
> Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has
> decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in
> "successfully ridding Australian society of guns." You won't see this
> on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the
> State Assembly
> disseminating this information.
>
> The Australian experience proves it. Guns in the hands of honest
> citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect
> only the law-abiding citizens.
>
> Take note Americans, before it's too late!
>
> FORWARD TO EVERYONE ON YOUR EMAIL LIST.
> DON'T BE A MEMBER OF THE SILENT MAJORITY.
> BE OF THE VOCAL MINORITY WHO WON'T LET THIS HAPPEN IN THE U.S.A
>
>

[Mudgoer]

And I'll bet the average cop, like in England, is armed with a stick.
I hope www.nra.org gets this message from down under and publishes it in American Rifleman.

Rick

[WhiteRhino]

This news has to be publicized and spread!

[Roadhouse]

I'm not giving up my guns, in fact I think I need to buy more this year. I need a hand gun or 2.

[roll-bar Bob]

this is where law makers can turn us into law breakers and shows us what we need to stand up for rights.




RBB B)

[PeteC]

Hasn't anybody learned to be suspect of things found in your e-mail inbox?

Please click on the following link:

Snopes - Aussie gun law (http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp)

An unarmed populace? Mass taking of guns? Think again.

A few excerpts:


In the specific case offered here, context is the most important factor. The piece quoted above leads the reader to believe that much of the Australian citizenry owned handguns until their ownership was made illegal and all firearms owned by "law-abiding citizens" were collected by the government through a buy-back program in 1997. This is not so. Australian citizens do not (and never did) have a constitutional right to own firearms ? even before the 1997 buyback program, handgun ownership in Australia was restricted to certain groups, such as those needing weapons for occupational reasons, members of approved sporting clubs, hunters, and collectors. Moreover, the 1997 buyback program did not take away all the guns owned by these groups; only some types of firearms (primarily semi-automatic and pump-action weapons) were banned. And even with the ban in effect, those who can demonstrate a legitimate need to possess prohibited categories of firearms can petition for exemptions from the law. [/b]





....An examination of statistics from the Australian Institute of Criminology (AIC) reveals that the overall homicide rate in Australia has changed little over the past decade and actually dipped slightly after the 1997 gun buy-back program....[/b]


....it should be noted that the Australia-wide percentage of homicides committed with firearms is now lower than it was before the gun buy-back program....[/b]


Come on people, don't jump on a band wagon until you check out the facts. I am not an anti-gun nut, I am just a person that believes in fact.

[WhiteRhino]

I would guess that statistics can be found to support or refute most any highly debated social subject.

Not saying the either way is right or wrong.

[PeteC]

Statistics are one thing and I agree, you can turn numbers to refute or support anything.

But, read the "cops" letter and the snopes article again. Some of the things the "cop" wrote or eluded to were just plain wrong.

Did it not seem to all of you that Australia had similar gun "rights as we have here? Read snopes and you will see that they did not.

There are guns left in Australia. It may be harder to own them, but they are there.

But, this is something that the NRA would jump all over. Personally I think the NRA is just as extremist as the anti gun crowd. I do not support either side.

I am a gun owner who wants to keep my guns, but can not support an organization that wants you to do "anything necessary" to fight the anti gun crowd.

Anyway, as I said earlier, just thought I would present some facts after reading the "cops" letter and seeing your responses.


p.s. I don't believe the author of this letter was an Australian at all. Something just does not seem right. Must be the accent. If youhave ever readm anything written by someone who speaks a different language (and Australian really is) then you will understand what I mean. There are differences in word usage and sentence structure. This letter just seems to American. To much like any of us would write.

[WhiteRhino]

Pete,
I have no arguement with anything you said. I too am a gun owner who wants to keep them. And, like you, not a member of NRA.

So, with all that we have said, I still believe as they say: when guns are outlawed, only the outlaws will have guns.

Nuff said on my part

Jim

[PeteC]

Originally posted by WhiteRhino@Apr 21 2005, 12:20 PM


So, with all that we have said, I still believe as they say: when guns are outlawed, only the outlaws will have guns.


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[/quote]

I am in 100% agreement with this as well.

Just wanted to show the facts behind another Internet letter.

[roll-bar Bob]

I THINK THAT THE NRA HAS DONE A GREAT JOB TO HELP PROTECT OUR RIGHTS AND SOME TIMES YOU NEED TO FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE WHEN IT COMES TO THE ANTIGUN CROWD.



RBB

[WhiteRhino]

But the bottom line is: I NEVER NEVER NEVER want to be lied to. Tell me the truth & let me make my own decisions.



Originally posted by roll&#045;bar Bob@Apr 21 2005, 01:36 PM
I THINK THAT THE NRA HAS DONE A GREAT JOB TO HELP PROTECT OUR RIGHTS AND SOME TIMES YOU NEED TO FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE WHEN IT COMES TO THE ANTIGUN CROWD.



RBB
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[/quote]

[roll-bar Bob]

NO ONE WONTS TO BE LIED TO :<img src=:" border="0" alt="mad.gif" /> AND WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO IT ANY THING YOU GET FROM ANY SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP I ALWAYS THINK THERE IS A SPIN ON IT. BUT AS A MEMBER OF THE NRA I KNOW THAT THEY ARE WORKING ON KEEPING A EYE ON THE THINGS THAT I DONT ALWAYS HAVE THE TIME TO MUCH LIKE GL DOES WHEN IT COMES TO 4-WHEELING TOPICS.

RBB





Originally posted by WhiteRhino+Apr 21 2005, 03:18 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(WhiteRhino &#064; Apr 21 2005, 03:18 PM)</div>
But the bottom line is: I NEVER NEVER NEVER want to be lied to. Tell me the truth & let me make my own decisions.


<!--QuoteBegin-roll&#045;bar Bob@Apr 21 2005, 01:36 PM
I THINK THAT THE NRA HAS DONE A GREAT JOB TO HELP PROTECT OUR RIGHTS AND SOME TIMES YOU NEED TO FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE WHEN IT COMES TO THE ANTIGUN CROWD.



RBB
<div align="right">4815

<div align="right">4816</div>
[/b][/quote]

[Nvrenuf]

Hi Guys
I&#39;m going to step in on this one also.

Pete Snopes.com is a fun site for debunking myths but you may have stopped your search to soon. All the Snopes links are to old Austrailian Goverment sites. That doesen&#39;t seem real balanced. :blink:

The text of the Snopes article is a copy of a WorldNetDaily (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=15322) article refuting an NRA video.

Here is the NRA Page (http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?ID=30) that talks about this issue and video.

[quote]"However, the use of handguns in homicides in Australia has increased from 13% in 1995/96 to 42% in 1998/99. Positively though, not one handgun used in a homicide between 1997 and 1999 was used by a licensed owner. One gun was registered, but to the victim."

This quote comes from this Goverment Page (http://www.aic.gov.au/media/20000726.html) that is in the links.

Again this is just giving a little more info to think about.
Steve

[Creative Fab]

That is just what I was thinking Steve, you just proved it to me with the research you have done. Thanks&#33;