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hitechman
March 26th, 2013, 12:19 AM
ORV Bills HB4299 and SB0050

There are at least two ORV bills that should interest some of you.

Probably the most important is House Bill 4299. This bill would remove the concept of "eligible counties" and provide that all counties in Michigan can determine for them selves (along with their respective townships and municipalities) to develop ordinances--or to not do so within their respective jurisdictions. Essentially, it makes statewide what is now only the north and some of the central counties, to be able to enact ordinances. I suggest you read it and advocate for its adoption by calling your Reps in the House and, if passed there, calling and writing your State Senators. To me its good news and puts in your hands the ability to influence the process toward an end for which we did not see a path last year.

The second bill is Senate Bill 0050 and it changes slightly the definition of ORV and introduces the definition of an ROV (Recreational off road vehicle). I think this bill, containing many other provisions should also be supported as it better encompasses all sorts of vehicles that could be considered--such as golf carts--but I think it has a firm requirement for these vehicles to be equipped with non-road tires. That is fine with me-we just need to make sure the cart people understand that point. There is lots of manufacturer stuff that needs more reflection than I have been able to do up to now.

If you support them, get others to support them as well by actively contacting their legislative officials. Remember one call is "ho hum," three or more is maybe "my constituency may be saying something to me," and ten or more calls means "the people who voted me into office want this to happen." Look up the committees to which these bills have been referred, and if one of your reps is on the committee--tell them you support the legislation and you want the bill(s) to be brought up, passed by the Committee with a recommendation to approve and placed on the House or Senate Calendar for approval votes. Even if not, call the Committee Chair's Chief of Staff and urge getting it out of Committee with a recommendation to pass the bill.

Steve

hemrides
March 26th, 2013, 07:20 PM
why is there a requirement to have non road tires on ROVs. If it allows golf carts to go on the trails why the tire issue?

Rocky
March 26th, 2013, 07:51 PM
Steve,
forgive me if im incorrect, but I think you are crossing SB 0050 with SB 0068?

Sponsor
Goeffrey Hansen

Categories Vehicles, off-road

Vehicles; off-road; definition of ATV; revise to create separate category of recreational off-road vehicles. Amends secs. 81101, 81129 & 81130 of 1994 PA 451 (MCL 324.81101 et seq.)

SB 0068 is an attempt to make off road vehicle's currently classified as ORV's that are wider than 50 inches in width and up to 65 inches in width and re-classify them as ROV's. This change from ORV over to ROV is meaningless in my opinion. I'll tell you why. Any current off road vehicle that is wider than 50 inches in width can only be operated on ORV Routes or Scramble areas, and if under 60 inches in width, may also operate under PA 250 with head lights and tail lights. Changing it's definition from an ORV over to a ROV does NOTHING for where it may legally operate at. So I see no use in adding another meaningless definition to an already difficult group of ATV's & ORV's. It will only confuse user's more than they already are.A golf cart if already classified as an ORV under Michigan law if it is being used off road. In 2009,Representative Sheltrown amended the definition of an ATV, and it too, was meaningless to Michigan riders.

This same 0068 Bill, contains new language that would also now make it illegal for out of State ORV safety certificates to be recognized while riding in the State of Michigan. This is no good and should not be supported in my opinion. In times when our ORV sport is hurting very badly for funds, if passed, 1000s of families from out of State who have younger riding youth will NOT want to come twice to Michigan. Once, for a Michigan State approved Safety class/certificate, and once again to ride. If passed, this newly amended law would hurt our local ORV communities because those families with youth who can currently ride an ATV/ORV with their out of State safety certificate's will NOT be coming to spend their $$ to buy ORV stickers, hotels/motels/fuel/repairs/ect, thus not only hurting our sport, but also Michigan's economy. And to tell you the truth, the DNR's ORV Instructor's safety academy is nothing to write home about. There are many youth from out of State who come to Michigan to ride that were trained through the Nationally recognized SVIA [ Specialty Vehicle Institute of America ] These Instructors are well trained and are certified by professional Chief Instructors. Those who instruct the Michigan DNR Instructors Academy are ''learn as we go'' instructors and do not compare to the chief instructors through SVIA. I know, I've participated in both! Not accepting an out of State ORV safety certificate from SVIA is like comparing a Chevette to a Corvette. No comparison.

hitechman
March 26th, 2013, 08:08 PM
SB 0068is a different bill entirely and I completly OPPOSE IT.

SB 0050 was introduced on January 16, 2013, by Senator CASPERSON

No idea on the tire requirement......I'm guessing to keep them off the pavement (smooth ride with road tires, and thus encourage not to ride on far right) and on the shoulder.

Steve

Rocky
March 27th, 2013, 04:56 PM
Thanks Steve,
I'll carefully look over SB OO50.

Rocky
March 27th, 2013, 05:54 PM
Steve,
after examining all of SB 0050, I do not understand the Rational behind changing some of the language regarding ORV and ATV's.

(a) "ATV" means a 3-, 4-, or 6-wheeled vehicle WITH 3 OR MORE
3. WHEELS THAT IS designed for off-road use, that has low-pressure
4. tires, has a seat designed to be straddled by the rider, and is
5. powered by a 50cc to 1,000cc gasoline engine or an engine of comparable size using other fuels.

(R) (o) "ORV" or, UNLESS THE CONTEXT IMPLIES A DIFFERENT
24. MEANING, "vehicle" means a motor-driven off-road recreation vehicle
25. capable of cross-country travel without benefit of a road or trail,
26. on or immediately over land, snow, ice, marsh, swampland, or other
27. natural terrain. ORV or vehicle includes, but is not limited to a multitrack or multiwheel drive vehicle.
an ATV, a motorcycle or
2. related 2-wheel VEHICLE, A 3-wheel, 4-wheel, or 6-wheel vehicle
3. WITH 3 OR MORE WHEELS, an amphibious machine, a ground effect air
4. cushion vehicle, or other means of transportation deriving motive
5. power from a source other than muscle or wind, MAY BE AN ORV. AN
6. ATV IS AN ORV.

ANY off road vehicle in the State of Michigan that does not fit all the criteria's of an ATV as defined in its MCL, is AUTOMATICALLY defined as an ORV under Michigan law. And further , even though an ATV is a ''SUB GROUP'' of an ORV, it is not legally a ORV if it fits all the definitions of an ATV under the MCL of ATVs.

Can somebody please explain the Rational behind this change?

hemrides
March 28th, 2013, 07:14 AM
and then we wonder why gov. Has things so messed up??. :banghead:

Rocky
March 29th, 2013, 08:26 AM
Can somebody please explain the Rational behind this change?

I guess not!

hitechman
March 29th, 2013, 11:56 AM
Golf carts and others are not currently defined as OHV/ORV's. This would add them to that definition. They probably want road tires off golf carts so better traction off road, and to keep them off the paved road surface.

I know when we worked on the ORV Ordinances in Gratiot County and the City of St. Louis, we specificaly had to add to include golf carts as they were not included under the current law. Lots of counties with ORV laws EXCLUDE golf carts because they are not mentioned as an ORV allowed on county roads.

Steve

Rocky
March 29th, 2013, 03:49 PM
[QUOTE=hitechman;68213]Golf carts and others are not currently defined as OHV/ORV's. This would add them to that definition. They probably want road tires off golf carts so better traction off road, and to keep them off the paved road surface.

I know when we worked on the ORV Ordinances in Gratiot County and the City of St. Louis, we specificaly had to add to include golf carts as they were not included under the current law. Lots of counties with ORV laws EXCLUDE golf carts because they are not mentioned as an ORV allowed on county roads.
STEVE----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lets take a look at the Definition of an ORV under current MCL,

(o) "ORV" or "vehicle" means a motor-driven off-road recreation vehicle capable of cross-country travel without benefit of a road or trail, on or immediately over land, snow, ice, marsh, swampland, or other natural terrain. ORV or vehicle includes, but is not limited to, a multitrack or multiwheel drive vehicle, an ATV, a motorcycle or related 2-wheel, 3-wheel, 4-wheel, or 6-wheel vehicle, an amphibious machine, a ground effect air cushion vehicle, or other means of transportation deriving motive power from a source other than muscle or wind. ORV or vehicle does not include a registered snowmobile, a farm vehicle being used for farming, a vehicle used for military, fire, emergency, or law enforcement purposes, a vehicle owned and operated by a utility company or an oil or gas company when performing maintenance on its facilities or on property over which it has an easement, a construction or logging vehicle used in performance of its common function, or a registered aircraft.

SB 0050 proposed CHANGES

(R) (o) "ORV" or, UNLESS THE CONTEXT IMPLIES A DIFFERENT
MEANING, "vehicle" means a motor-driven off-road recreation vehicle
capable of cross-country travel without benefit of a road or trail,
on or immediately over land, snow, ice, marsh, swampland, or other
natural terrain. ORV or vehicle includes, but is not limited to, a
A multitrack or multiwheel drive vehicle, an ATV, a motorcycle or
related 2-wheel VEHICLE, A 3-wheel, 4-wheel, or 6-wheel vehicle
WITH 3 OR MORE WHEELS, an amphibious machine, a ground effect air
cushion vehicle, or other means of transportation deriving motive
power from a source other than muscle or wind, MAY BE AN ORV. AN
ATV IS AN ORV. ORV or vehicle does not include a registered
snowmobile, a farm vehicle being used for farming, a vehicle used
for military, fire, emergency, or law enforcement purposes, a
vehicle owned and operated by a utility company or an oil or gas
company when performing maintenance on its facilities or on
property over which it has an easement, a construction or logging
vehicle used in performance of its common function, or a registered
aircraft.


What part of the above definition of an ORV does not define a GOLF CART as an ORV when used off road?

Under PA 451, section 811, there is no such vehicle as a OHV in Michigan. We either have ATV's in Michigan or we have ORV's.

WhiteRhino
March 29th, 2013, 07:08 PM
I cannot comprehend why a gold cart would not be included............ or should not be included. I also think from an ohv type vehicle standpoint that the type of tire is meaningless. Who cares of the vehicle has an aggressive tread or a turf tread? That should be the choice of the user.

hemrides
March 29th, 2013, 09:39 PM
My thoughts exactly....again leave it to the gov

Rocky
March 30th, 2013, 04:53 AM
I cannot comprehend why a gold cart would not be included............ or should not be included. I also think from an ohv type vehicle standpoint that the type of tire is meaningless. Who cares of the vehicle has an aggressive tread or a turf tread? That should be the choice of the user.

When you look at the definition of a ORV, a golf cart does indeed fit the criteria of an ORV under Michigan law. No need for meaningless change. Just another example of State Representatives who dont know much about some of the proposed laws they go after.