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Ridgerunner
January 17th, 2006, 09:03 AM
I'm looking at getting into a heavy duty tow vehicle with a deisel. Does anyone have any performance info such as torque and H.P. on say cummins deisela that were used in late 90's versus whats available when buying new? I know the specs I got from the Dodge site listed them at 610 ft/lbs and 325 HP for current production models.I'm wonder If I should buy new or find a used truck. Any info would be great.

Creative Fab
January 17th, 2006, 11:04 AM
Look at a 98 or newer, these will be the 24 valve models and have many more options for upgrades should you decide to do that.

I am driving a 04.5 model with the 610/325 motor and I have installed a PDQ performance add on chip and open element air filter. This chip has a stock setting plus a 60 and 100 HP setting. With this setup I increased my mileage significantly, 14 mpg's towing a 40' enclosed car hauler on the 60 hp setting and empty on the highway on 100 hp I can squeeze out 29.5 mpg at 65 miles per hour.

So for you money definately go with the 24 valve version 98 and newer, and if you can swing it go for a new one. Great deals right now as they really want to move new vehicles. Mine is leased so it made it somewhat more affordable but on the other hand I am over on miles and will no doubt have to pay a penalty when I turn it in.

If you get one and want to look at upgrades give me a shout, I carry a long list of performance Diesel upgrades.

Tab
January 17th, 2006, 11:32 AM
On sites like thedeiselregistry.com they usually recommend (for used) any dodge 94 and up. The ones 94 to 98 are 12 valve and VERY easy to work on and modify because they are not completely controlled by computers. Great bang for the buck too. The 24 valve are more complicated but just as potent (also more expensive). Go to some of the bigger diesel sites and read up. You can make an older cummins just as powerful as a new truck for pretty cheap. The years basically dictate how easy they are to work on and how much it costd to do so. The stock newer numbers are real easy to surpass with some simple mods. I will hopefully be buying a 96 or so in the next year with a stick and make it rule the world (at least in my mind) but with that being said if I could buy a new one then I would probably get a new dodge. Even though there ugly. :bigemo_harabe_net-163:

Ridgerunner
January 17th, 2006, 12:25 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Jan 17 2006, 10&#58;04 AM) 8305</div>


I am driving a 04.5 model with the 610/325 motor and I have installed a PDQ performance add on chip and open element air filter. This chip has a stock setting plus a 60 and 100 HP setting. With this setup I increased my mileage significantly, 14 mpg&#39;s towing a 40&#39; enclosed car hauler on the 60 hp setting and empty on the highway on 100 hp I can squeeze out 29.5 mpg at 65 miles per hour.

[/b]


I&#39;m looking at a 99 2500 with an automatic and 140 K on it.Not sold on the price though. Are you getting this kind of milage with an automatic or manual?any pro"s or con"s with tranny&#39;s in 99? Thanks for the info.

95geo
January 17th, 2006, 01:25 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ridgerunner &#064; Jan 17 2006, 11&#58;25 AM) 8313</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Jan 17 2006, 10&#58;04 AM) 8305


I am driving a 04.5 model with the 610/325 motor and I have installed a PDQ performance add on chip and open element air filter. This chip has a stock setting plus a 60 and 100 HP setting. With this setup I increased my mileage significantly, 14 mpg&#39;s towing a 40&#39; enclosed car hauler on the 60 hp setting and empty on the highway on 100 hp I can squeeze out 29.5 mpg at 65 miles per hour.

[/b]


I&#39;m looking at a 99 2500 with an automatic and 140 K on it.Not sold on the price though. Are you getting this kind of milage with an automatic or manual?any pro"s or con"s with tranny&#39;s in 99? Thanks for the info.
[/b][/quote]

im not calling bs but those numbers are VERY hard to achieve (maybe a freak truck?). i wouldnt expect anywhere close.... maybe low 20s

i have an 04.5 duramax and i get about 17-18 50/50 split and i have gotten a best of 17.5 towink 5k.... on average i get about 15 towing

this is an extended cab short bed srw

Creative Fab
January 17th, 2006, 06:19 PM
Tab will back me up on these numbers he has seen it with his own eyes. And your welcome to go for a ride and peek at the overhead mileage readout as we travel.

If I switch the chip to stock setting the mileage goes down to 17 on the highway, it&#39;s a PDQ thing I guess&#33;

And this is an Automatic with 4:10&#39;s and is a 4x4 dually

Ridgerunner
January 17th, 2006, 06:49 PM
WILL that chip work in other deisels or just the cummins? awesome nubers&#33;

Creative Fab
January 17th, 2006, 09:47 PM
The PDQ chip that I have is only for the Cummins, but there is a chip, or several for all of the Diesels.

I deal in Edge, PDQ, and Diablo sport Chips and Tuners, along with Magnflow exhaust for the Diesels and some Mustang applications.

95geo
January 17th, 2006, 11:07 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Jan 17 2006, 05&#58;19 PM) 8335</div>

and peek at the overhead mileage readout as we travel.


[/b]

if thats the case then i can get 99 mpg (thats how high my readout goes)

drive on one tank, divide miles traveled by gallons of fuel consumed. that is how you calculate mileage

Creative Fab
January 17th, 2006, 11:18 PM
Thanks genius, I know how to calculate mileage. I am sorry you think I am trying to bull**** about my mileage, it has been calculated several times and comes out the same as the Daimler Chrysler overhead readout. Maybe if you would have bought a Dodge with the Cummins you would get better mileage and your overhead readouts would be more accurate. :bigemo_harabe_net-163:

I only told you to look at the trucks display while you rode with me becuase I am sure you wouldn&#39;t want to go for a ride through a tank of fuel to calculate it the old fashion way, you might not like my taste in music&#33;

Ridgerunner
February 2nd, 2006, 07:49 AM
After swaying back and forth on new or used ,I bought a 99 Quad cab automatic. Got it from original owner and all service records. The only down side is that it has 3.55 gears. Also, It has 305/75 mud terrains on it. I&#39;m wondering if I should upgrad to 4.10&#39;s or 4.56 to compensate for the tire size?What&#39;s a safe highway RPM range with a diesel?With the current set up, I&#39;m turning about 2000rpm&#39;s @ 70mph. This thing seems to have good power with the stock gearing. any info would be great.

Roadhouse
February 2nd, 2006, 09:19 AM
I would just put the factory size tires back on it when the current MT&#39;s wear out.

Creative Fab
February 2nd, 2006, 09:59 AM
With my stock gearing of 4:10 and the stock size tires I run 2,200 -2,300 at 70 mph in OD

So your not far off on RPM&#39;s, but a good test is to tow whatever you will be towing and if it lags on hills and wants to down shift at the smallest of inlcines than your geared to high. But like Mike said, change back to stock tire size first.


So tell us more, color, options, 4x4?

Let me know when you want some performance goodies&#33; I have a nice 4" stainless Magnaflow exhaust for ya&#33;

Ridgerunner
February 2nd, 2006, 10:29 AM
Yea I know the tire size is the easiest fix but the rubber is almost new&#33; looks a little beefier with larger tires too. Its kinda like a jeep thing I think,but hopefully wont turn into a a big project like the jeep has.The wife really likes it , so I&#39;m off to a good start. It&#39;s a 99 3/4 ton SLT , Quad cab,black, short box. I&#39;m going to be haulin my 14&#39; tool trailer for work mostly,about 5 to 6000 lbs loaded,and jeep and trailer to runs sometimes when were not using the motorhome to tow on wheelin trips.Pat ,what size tires are on the dually? my door tag say&#39;s I should have 265&#39;s on it.

Roadhouse
February 2nd, 2006, 11:09 AM
I believe the dually came with 235/85R16 which is the same height as a 265/75R16 just skinnier.

If you do keep the 305&#39;s and decide to regear, I wouldn&#39;t go 4:56, don&#39;t go any lower than 4:10&#39;s. But like Pat said, tow with it and see how the 3.55&#39;s do with those 33" tires.

I agree with you on wanting a little bigger tire, the Dodge&#39;s have big wheel wells that look funny with stock tires.

Creative Fab
February 2nd, 2006, 11:20 AM
My tires are a 235/80R17

You wont have to worry about it, you will not be stressing a diesel 3/4 ton with what you are hauling. It&#39;s when you start hauling around the max GVWR on a regular basis, your not even close. The Dodge auto trannies are what will suffer the most under heavy loads with high gearing.

That&#39;s why I said if it does excessive downshifting while towing up and down hills you should consider changing something.

Now you will be looking for Flying J truck stops to get the least expensive fuel, hopefully you have one closer to you than I do&#33;

95geo
February 2nd, 2006, 12:03 PM
i have a .71 od 3.73&#39;s and 33-34s and i turn about 2k at 70-73. with a diesel you shouldnt have to worry about downshifting the torque should just keep on pulling

for what its worth i get better mileage with h2 tires than i did with stock 245&#39;s

Creative Fab
February 2nd, 2006, 12:44 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(95geo &#064; Feb 2 2006, 12&#58;03 PM) 9509</div>

i have a .71 od 3.73&#39;s and 33-34s and i turn about 2k at 70-73. with a diesel you shouldnt have to worry about downshifting the torque should just keep on pulling
[/b]

Depends on where your shift points are set at&#33; If it is lagging due to higher gears it is going to want to downshift to bring the RPM&#39;s back up. Thus bringing your torque curve back to it&#39;s optimal level. Espeacially(sp) with the soft Dodge automatic. This can be controlled with the aftermarket tuners available, like the ones from Diablo Sport or Hypertec if you decide to run the larger tires and it becomes an issue. These tuners allow you to set your own shift points.

Roadhouse
February 2nd, 2006, 03:33 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(95geo &#064; Feb 2 2006, 11&#58;03 AM) 9509</div>


for what its worth i get better mileage with h2 tires than i did with stock 245&#39;s
[/b]


I&#39;m gonna call bs on that one :haha:

95geo
February 2nd, 2006, 03:56 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Roadhouse &#064; Feb 2 2006, 02&#58;33 PM) 9532</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(95geo &#064; Feb 2 2006, 11&#58;03 AM) 9509


for what its worth i get better mileage with h2 tires than i did with stock 245&#39;s
[/b]


I&#39;m gonna call bs on that one :haha:
[/b][/quote]

1.5 mpg increase, hand calculated and corrected for the tire size :bigemo_harabe_net-145:

and another story for you to call bs on me: i took it in to work the other day and on my way in a cts-v was at a red light next to me, i taunted him as we took off... i heard his car start to open up so i rolled into it hard, we went wide open to about 65 where we both backed out neck and neck with eachother..... if he could shift quicker i would have been in trouble... when a certain new tune comes out i should run 13 flat on diesel only


and another for the hell of it, 96ish camaro z28 (exhaust, performance stickers all over it) down in the city driving along, he takes off fast form a light so i catch up (im always looking to play) we both had the same thing in mind. he rolled his window down and asked why my truck whistled, i just said "it just does that" and i asked if he had anything done to his car and he said it has a straight pipe and intake. then he said "why do you think you can keep up or something?" (sarcastically) i said "i dunno, lets see......" a few seconds later the light turned green and he got the jump but i caught him as i hit second, by the time i was at about 60-65 i had over 1/2 a car length on him..... i backed out, he did the ricer-fly-by and took the next michigan left....

Roadhouse
February 2nd, 2006, 04:29 PM
Bryce, I was just joking about the bs thing. I actually was thinking it should show way worse unless you changed the speedo gear. The larger tire would be racking up less miles on the odometer for you to calculate the gallons used per shown miles.

Anyway, I know you have a Dmax....but what are all the mods you have done to the engine? I luv diesels and listening to the mods and power people have into them.

Which leads me to another question I haven&#39;t searched yet.........is the aftermarket on the band wagon with chips, tuners, etc for the Liberty diesel? I get a new company vehicle this spring and it will be a Liberty LT w/ the diesel...just wanted to spruce it up a bit.

Ridgerunner
February 2nd, 2006, 05:12 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Feb 2 2006, 10&#58;20 AM) 9506</div>

My tires are a 235/80R17

You wont have to worry about it, you will not be stressing a diesel 3/4 ton with what you are hauling. It&#39;s when you start hauling around the max GVWR on a regular basis, your not even close. The Dodge auto trannies are what will suffer the most under heavy loads with high gearing.

[/b]
Yea ,I read somthing in the owners manual about that refering to the trannie. It did&#39;nt mention turning off the over drive unless you start getting excessive down shifting.Trans was rebuilt about 20k ago and done at the local dodge dealer. Not sure what was the cause of the failure,but the manual say&#39;s to change fluid and filter every 15k.I burned up up 2 gm trannies in my old pick up from running 33&#39;s and no gear change.I&#39;ve had it only a week and havent moved my work trailer yet. I think I&#39;ll wait and see how it does before I change gears.
Pat &#39;do the tuner or chip mod&#39;s you sell also adjust shift patterns like the others you mentioned? What kinda dough are we talking for a chip mod? Would also be interested in getting a Quote for a full cage built for the jeep.

95geo
February 2nd, 2006, 08:49 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Roadhouse &#064; Feb 2 2006, 03&#58;29 PM) 9536</div>


..but what are all the mods you have done to the engine? I luv diesels and listening to the mods and power people have into them.


[/b]

i dont have much done to mine... suncoast modded trans, triple disk torque converter, edge juice with attitude, egt and boost gauges, had a predator but sold it, boost stick and egr block plate and stick, 4" exhaust without cat. converter. i run about a 14.3 with the juice and with the predator stacked it was about 13.9..... when they release the tts extreme (april 1) i will have dual lift pumps, a fuel pressure relief valve shim, tierod sleves (so the tiny tie rods dont buckle doing 4x4 launches) and the tts extreme of course..... that should be good for at least 13.1 on diesel only.


im not sure about the liberty diesels.... im sure theyll get them pretty quick soon enough

joe_jeep
February 3rd, 2006, 10:19 AM
i know a friend that has a dodge 3/4 ton 4x4 with edge tuner and he has gone through a few trannys, suprised u guys dont use more manual trans trucks ?? i would think they would hold up to the power levels better and only need a clutch once in a while when theres a problem??? why the automatics???

95geo
February 3rd, 2006, 11:22 AM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(joe_jeep &#064; Feb 3 2006, 09&#58;19 AM) 9577</div>

i know a friend that has a dodge 3/4 ton 4x4 with edge tuner and he has gone through a few trannys, suprised u guys dont use more manual trans trucks ?? i would think they would hold up to the power levels better and only need a clutch once in a while when theres a problem??? why the automatics???
[/b]

easy, for me i drive in a lot of city traffic and dont like to shift and an automatic shifts faster than any manual aside from an air shifted version found in f1 cars and the like, you typically need 100 more hp in a manual truck to keep up with an automatic.

for running serious power you have to upgrade your stock clutch also, so nomatter what you run your spending 3-5k to hold a significant amount of extra power

Ridgerunner
February 4th, 2006, 06:49 AM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(joe_jeep &#064; Feb 3 2006, 09&#58;19 AM) 9577</div>

i know a friend that has a dodge 3/4 ton 4x4 with edge tuner and he has gone through a few trannys, suprised u guys dont use more manual trans trucks ??
[/b]
I thought about a manual but my truck is my office. phone calls, coffee cups and so on . automatic is more office friendly for me.I agree though, the manual would offer longer life span.

roll-bar Bob
February 7th, 2006, 08:33 AM
:bigemo_harabe_net-145: I LOVE MY 20O4.95 RAM 3500




the newer the better buy it pay it off drive it for ever :thumb-up:





RBB

Ridgerunner
February 9th, 2006, 10:22 PM
well after owning this old girl for a couple weeks now, I was wondering if anbody has any tips on cold weather starting. Now that winter is back here in feb. the truck seems to start a little hard first thing in the morning but is fine the rest of the day. I don&#39;t have a block heater to plug in at night. is it easy to add one or could it be handled some other way? any tips would be great.

Creative Fab
February 9th, 2006, 11:19 PM
are you sure the block heater isnt there?

I didnt think I had one on one of my other duallies, but after looking around I found the plug hiding under the hood next to the radiator.

And on my 04.5 it was there but I had to buy the cord to plug into it. The dealership wanted me to buy the block heater, they didnt know that I knew it came with one from the factory. The salesmans face was seven shades of red :haha:

A block heater is the only thing I can think of that will help you out.

95geo
February 10th, 2006, 08:53 AM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Feb 9 2006, 10&#58;19 PM) 9979</div>

are you sure the block heater isnt there?

I didnt think I had one on one of my other duallies, but after looking around I found the plug hiding under the hood next to the radiator.

And on my 04.5 it was there but I had to buy the cord to plug into it. The dealership wanted me to buy the block heater, they didnt know that I knew it came with one from the factory. The salesmans face was seven shades of red :haha:

A block heater is the only thing I can think of that will you out.
[/b]

ya, block heater or maybe try some fuel additives

Creative Fab
February 10th, 2006, 09:02 AM
Bryce, have you ever tried cetane boost?

I haven&#39;t but was wondering if you would really notice a difference or not.

Ridgerunner
February 11th, 2006, 02:22 PM
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ironman &#064; Feb 9 2006, 10&#58;19 PM) 9979</div>

are you sure the block heater isnt there?

I didnt think I had one on one of my other duallies, but after looking around I found the plug hiding under the hood next to the radiator.


[/b]

Well what&#39;a ya know.On my 3rd time looking for my plug, I found it this morning with alittle help from the owners manual&#33; I guess it pays to read those books once and a while.I tend to get caught up in the "don&#39;t need the directions metallity" sometimes. IT was hidden pretty well though ,tucked in behind the headlight. cold starting problem solved&#33; thanks everyone for all the pointers.

roll-bar Bob
February 13th, 2006, 01:43 PM
on those mornings when it is real cold i will turn the key on till the wire coil goes out on the dash then take the key out and do it agin in essance hitting the glow plugs twice and then fire it up&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;







RBB

Roadhouse
February 13th, 2006, 02:09 PM
We have a 93 Chevy w/6.5L TD at work without a block heater. I wonder if the cord is hidden like on these Dodges? I&#39;m going to investigate it a little more. I was using it quit a bit last November instead of my Explorer and cold mornings suck with that old engine.

Creative Fab
February 13th, 2006, 10:03 PM
I have not seen to many diesels without a factory installed block heater, so I would place abet Mike that you will find a cord hidden under the hood.

joe_jeep
February 14th, 2006, 09:17 AM
i drive a semi truck and the only thing truckers use in the way of fuel additives is howes meaner power cleaner.
sell it by the case. ive never seen a trucker dump in anything else. i dont use anything and ive put 350,000 on this truck im in now, no probs yet. ive seen cetane boost at the truck stop but never seen anyone use it.

roll-bar Bob
February 14th, 2006, 09:29 AM
BUT SOME DONT, MY BUDDY HAS A 99 F350 WITH OUT ONE IT IS NOT THERE